Talk:XMP vehicles

Should we have the XMP vehicles all on the same page? UT2004/UT3 vehicles are being separated out, but those will generally have more content than there will be for these. --Haarg 04:50, 14 August 2007 (EDT)

As you said, the amount of content is one reason why I chose to do one big article. Maybe if somebody (multiple bodies) adds info about the different vehicles, they will be more deserving of their own articles, but I don't expect this to happen. I think it's a crying shame, but XMP never got of the ground properly, and it's dead for most intents and purposes. :( This also means vehicles probably won't be returning like the UT ones, which helped those in the article content department. Well, maybe due to UTXMP someone will add a bunch of tactics and the like, stretching he article enough to split it up. Speaking of which-like, there should be some embedded vehicles images in the article. :) Retodon8 10:26, 14 August 2007 (EDT)

I'm thinking about that now. Probably will add some info, and split them up. By the way, don't you think Unreal Tournament vehicles should be simply named Vehicles or Useable Vehicles in Unreal Universe? Also, is it worth mentioning that Scorpion = enhanced Raptor, Hellbender = enhanced Harbinger and Goliath = enhanced Juggernaut? At least Scorpion model is essentially the same, as well as the concept, while Harbinger's seats are similar, plus overall feel, and Juggernaut's mesh and cannon is essentially similar (just the flame thrower was changed to a turret due to lack of particle damage and to help to defend from air). --GreatEmerald 17:24, 15 May 2008 (EDT)

I don't think there's any evidence that the 2004 vehicles were inspired by XMP. The hellbender and goliath are pretty standard vehicle concepts. It might be worth noting the scorpion vs raptor, as those vehicles do share a very similar look. — Haarg 00:31, 16 May 2008 (EDT)

Goliath is standard, but the Hellbender is not so standard. The facts that the driver can't use any weapons, the vehicle has one side and one back turret and one of those are powered by shock technology states the similarity between the Hellbender and the Harbinger. And even the names sound similarly. And the Jugg and Goliath are usual tanks, though are somewhat similar in the appearance and that both fire very powerful shots. By the way, is it mentioned somewhere about what created the vehicles? Any corporation? For me it looks like Axon's work, but who knows... --GreatEmerald 07:13, 16 May 2008 (EDT)

Unless things are explicitly stated, you can't assume things. For one, Unreal II takes place WELL before UT2004 (Unreal II took place in 2251, which is at least 50 years before UT2004, much less UT3) though to be fair, we know both Izanagi and Axon existed in 2260, via AS-Glacier. Just because a vehicle has similarities to another is silly (The Viper hovers like the Manta, for example; by your logic they're similar) and the fact their names sound similar is purely coincidental and probably nonsense. Also, remember that in UT3, the driver of the hellbender CAN fire the skymines by himself.

As for who made them? We can't say. Saying Axon here might not only be incorrect, it could be completely untrue. --Dark Pulse 12:09, 16 May 2008 (EDT)

There isn't anything really similar about the Goliath and Juggernaut aside from what they share with all tanks. They don't really look alike at all. The Hellbender and Harbinger is a similar case. It's a troop carrying vehicle, so what are you going to do? Give the passengers turrets. The scorpion and raptor are very different vehicles as well in terms of use in game. They do look somewhat similar, but that is likely because they are both supposed to be small futuristic wheeled vehicles. Given how closely the games were released, and that Onslaught was initially developed by an external studio, I think it's pretty unlikely UT2004's vehicles were inspired by XMP's in any way. — Haarg 12:30, 16 May 2008 (EDT)

Well OK, but still a short note that there are similar vehicles would be nice, though the Scorpion looks and drives just like the Raptor, even the top turret looks the same and there is a mechanism for grinding/cutting (thoguh strange that the Raptor name was taken by a flying vehicle...). About the corporation, sure, we will never know, but it's the most possible that it's Axon's or some minor corporation's. Izanagi is into things that give money, and giving vehicles to enemies probably doesn't give too much of that. Liandri - a may be. Phayder's style is just not that. And as there are no huge banners on the vehicles I think it's not Uxan's. --GreatEmerald 12:36, 16 May 2008 (EDT)

To say that any XMP vehicle drives like a UT2004 vehicle is a bit off given XMP's glitchy physics. But I do think that the Scorpion and Raptor are similar enough visually to warrant a mention. The others I just don't really see any similarity at all. — Haarg 14:43, 16 May 2008 (EDT)

I meant the speed - it's the fastest ground-based vehicle and the most easily destroyed one. And the others are similar in appearance (Jugg- "Tank-like") or seats (Harbie - "Shock turret, two turrets + driver, infantry carrier"). --GreatEmerald 16:04, 16 May 2008 (EDT)

The problem is, this comparison you are making here is like me saying "Oh, a Honda compact car is the same as a Honda minivan because they both have hatchback and seats and steering wheels!" There really is no comparison other than the most wide generalizations you can make "The tank seats two", "The Harbinger/Bender seat multiple and have an energy weapon in the passenger seat". Those are only similarities to the extent of "They both have steering wheels" would be. They vehicles look nothing alike and don't even serve similar functions. Additionally, the fact that XMP vehicles have boosting capabilities simply reinforces that the vehicles are nothing alike. As far as the corporation goes, it could be anybody that made them. Unreal 2 takes place 52 or 53 years before UT2004, and UT mentions a lot of minor corporations. And there is also UXAN as you mentioned in another threads, which is actually a more likely candidate than the Axon Corporation. --Sir Brizz 18:35, 16 May 2008 (EDT)

Well OK, OK, I get the point. Actually, it would be really fun to have the boosting ability in UT... And Stamina run boosting... Of course, it's changed to Adrenaline, but still. Well, I'll rewrite these into different articles some time, though I have lots of work remaining here. --GreatEmerald 02:57, 17 May 2008 (EDT)

I agree. I love the XMP gameplay. Unfortunately, it never really caught on. Even in it's glory days there were only a ffew servers with a few people playing at any given time. --Sir Brizz 10:01, 17 May 2008 (EDT)

Yeap, exactly. XMP is very similar to VCTF (or even slightly to BR, but just because it's similar to CTF) - you need to capture the Flag/Artifact/Ball and get it to your Flag/Artifact node/enemy hoop. And in both XMP and VCTF bots somehow don't like using vehicles too much. What I don't like in XMP is it's U2-style movemnt, that is, dodging that is almost like jumping, no double jumps (though XMP has a backpack), no Translocator, slow movement... Though I'm now trying to get XMP weapons work in usual UT2004 (actually, almost all work by now), and it really feels neat. When you get the Shotgun, you know that you are going to own everyone around, but you fall under the Magnum Pistol... Actually, they're a bit too powerful there as people don't usually have armour on, while in XMP people get up to 500 armour, but it's still very interesting, just that you have to keep an eye on the moving objects... And in ONS or VCTF they're just excellent. I'm going to release it as soon as I figure out how to get a drop-down box in Mutator Config page. Hmm, gone quite off-topic, but yea, XMP is somewhat unique and really fun. --GreatEmerald 16:45, 17 May 2008 (EDT)